We are having discussions and there is nothing wrong with that. Now while you may think “who cares about being likable or attractive” just think of how Daphne the heroine is portrayed. I just binged the show after a failed first attempt at watching, bc a podcast I respect mentioned a significant plot twist at the end. So yeah, they are "tokens." US is 13% black. Bridgerton wants to have Black characters while handwaving the reality of racism. Marina saying “I never would have known about George if it wasn’t for you”. Once again, and I can’t stess this enough, it’s okay to like the show and like the characters. I see what you mean about perspective but that’s not what I’m talking about. https://youtu.be/zYPB5nJV3h8, More posts from the BridgertonNetflix community. But having the two major characters in the show be played by black actors would have changed the whole dynamic. Unlike with the diversity and feminism in Bridgerton, this aspect of the show wasn’t very embellished. Season 2 was given the green light on January 21, 2021, which was confirmed by the show’s official Instagram account. I’m happy that just seeing Black people in a period piece was enough for some, but there is a season 2 coming, which means plenty of opportunity for Shonda & co to push even further. "Bridgerton" is the story of families clamoring for improved social standing in 1813 high-society London. Or say nothing at all. What I am doing is trying to analyze this story as someone would analyze Shakespeare, Dickens or Wilde. When you criticize Marina or her storyline people are ready to point their finger at you, ready to call you racist and such all the while you don't think or have the same stereotypes they assume you do. I mean, none of them even get a happy ending! But now that you’ve brought it up, I wanna know about it. “We put black people IN the show. The situation between her and George really meant anything and the stakes were never high enough to be fully invested into the story since it was pretty clear George was never coming around anyway. Looks like you're using new Reddit on an old browser. But good representation really matters, where people of colour are not just the side script to the larger story. Renewed for Season 2! Prior to … This doesn’t happen with the Black women. Also; why did her father send her away? I was expecting her to have her Cinderella moment but she basically stayed in the cellar the entire time. It’s better than nothing. These are all women with moral dilemmas who are struggling to make change their circumstances and for the most part they do. They simply pointed out that there’s still room for development. They don’t fall in love or have any visible family members. Would they be more gentle? I don't find the queen just cold and unlikeable, she has her goals, she's bored, she's commanding since she's the queen, and we get to see her softer side, a bit of her personality when we find out about her husband, the king and him probably having dementia, her true feelings for him with them being friends who become husband and wife - they truly loved each other and then had a great loss - their daughter. As for your point about it being diversity not uniformity, that just kind of proves my point. He is an artist who we learn is gay and wishes he could be with his lover. Either way there were plenty of moments that could have been taken from Daphne’s and the Duke’s sex scenes to flesh out other characters. Also, I want to point out that side character is not synonymous with token character. Even when she is “undesirable“ it is only because of her brother’s interference, nothing of her own doing. In Bridgerton, you have 4 of the major households black (Simon's, Queen, Danbury, Will's). I’m Chinese-American, and there’s always mixed emotions when you see representation in media because yes, you’re glad to see people of your background represented, but it’s also disappointing when it reinforces existing stereotypes. Either way, the point I’m making is not “more black characters”, the point I’m making is more “diverse/feminine black characters”. I also do not believe for one second the show was aiming to show that a dark-skinned male should or could be villainized. Everyone's entitled to their opinion of what they want to see in the show, whether it's sticking to the books' story line or changing it up. In actuality It’s not about gratitude, it’s about exploring racial implications. The story didn’t even bother explaining to us where she’s going. Please see our rules for further info. The solution is to not see color, but to acknowledge the negative impact of racist actions has had on those affected, and work towards making things better. It is definitely a leap forward and I can commend that, but my intention is to observe them from the angle of execution not intent. You’re definitely not the only one who feels this way. Color blind casting would have been similar to Brandy's Cinderella where you had an Asian son with a black mother and a white father. As for Lady Danbury, I love how strong and esteemed she is... but I can see how the portrayal also reinforces the “strong, sassy black woman” stereotype. Amen to this! Just as you were explaining it, it became clear that Marina’s story and her trauma just became a gateway for Daphne to both find resolution and still be the “white savior”. Well you have to understand that there are a lot of damaging stereotypes that poc characters endure. If you want to look at it as not being diverse.... You can do that but I don't think it's accurate perception. If he was playing Berbrooke, the show would still be diverse but would it be as impactful? "Are there no good black men?". Same with Lady Danbury. It’s the same stereotype you would see in any modern tv show no matter how much you like the character. This show is based on the Bridgerton book series by Julia Quinn. Tokenism in relation to black women relate to things that you see white women experiencing that black women don’t such as desirability or loving families. To only cast WOC (I hope that is the right abbreviation) characters for parts with a „good“ storylines would pretty much end the idea of colorblind casting. Her character was used to progress two white character's storylines. I am not grading Bridgerton nor am I classifying it as being either good or bad, I am simply analyzing it. The do not exist apart from everyone else’s drama. From race to incels, the modern "Bridgerton" twists hold a mirror up to today's shortcomings Showrunner Chris Van Dusen spoke to Salon … OP didn’t complain. I would have definitely been more interested in that. Lady Danbury is also a lovable character but once again she’s giving very “I don’t need no man vibe”. What you’re saying about Asian representation is also absolutely true. The show is always gonna be about a Bridgerton-sibling as the main character, and there are 8 of them, and asking for the supporting women characters to be black and all have big storylines is maybe a bit too much. None of the black women really experience this. I believe I can appreciate the work and enjoy it while still examining the implications being swept under the rug. The Bridgerton books by Quinn (who has a sketchy track record when it comes to commenting on diversity) don’t tackle race at all. Discussion of the show Bridgerton on Netflix. Bridgerton, whose massive wave of popularity is showing no signs of subsiding, is now Netflix’s biggest series ever by a wide margin.It pushed down to … Even when she is shamed, or disliked, most characters eventually turn around and see how wonderful she is. Well, well, well. The two most powerful women in the show are both black. They contain entertaining and sympathetic stories about the economic and social pressures on gentlewomen of early 19th century Britain. I was hoping we would get a glimpse of some “multidimensionality” with Will and his wife but their plot ended up being really inconsequential as it was kind of shoveled in last minute. I think it would’ve been a lot harder for the general public to accept a darker skinned black man in those sex scenes with a dainty and super pale Daphne. However when she feels like he doesn’t want her anymore she just kind of sulks. Lady Danbury acts as a Mr. Miyagi if you will but with no other description besides “she always says what’s on her mind to your face” because of course she does, that’s how older Black women are always portrayed. What was the breaking point of her trying to induce an abortion? She is all of these things and more to the audience. I know the diversity of the cast has been celebrated in this show, and rightfully so, but it should be stated that while it was good intentioned, it definitely still has its issues. These are questions to which we never get answers. As someone earlier in the thread brilliantly stated, you don’t even see these women sharing a kiss with anyone. && yeah, they could have made Marina a well-rounded character, but they made her a villain in Penelope's love story with Collin. I only ask that you hear me out and read to the end before you comment cause this is gonna be long: DISCLAIMER: I should start by saying that I think having BIPOC people featured in the show was GREAT and I LOVED pretty much all of the characters, but I couldn’t deny that there was definitely some tokenism going on in here: Now I can only speak for myself, but me and my friends (all Black women) discussed this show, and we all agreed that it was nice to see Black women taking center roles at first, but after a while we picked up on some very “tokenist” vibes. Each book in this eight book historical romance series features a member of the Bridgerton family. It’s not just about representation, it’s about what these characters symbolize and if they communicate a bad message or are essentially just the “help” to white protagonists, then it’s not really progressive. Of the three other "romances" we see 3 … I’m not sure that I agree, but I’m absorbing it nonetheless.”. With Phoebe Dynevor, Regé-Jean Page, Nicola Coughlan, Jonathan Bailey. What drives Lady Danbury? Being aware of the importance of representation and not falling into any typical tropes. That shows more self-awareness than the silly “nuh-uh, look at alllll the black people what are you talking about?” responses. Lots of times the story comes close but it eventually gets dropped into obscurity. This doesn't seem to be about diversity, but the concern that the call for diversity is causing people to discuss and advocate for changes in canon. Yes these are side characters and no I don’t expect them to take up the majority of plot, but when characters are given ample screen time, I expect them to have some semblance of a formative arc. I have read several of Julia Quinn’s fanciful romance novels. Bridgerton is more diverse than other historical pieces set in Regency England. Now either way I think she is an amazing character and I love watching her, but I think she should get some soft moments as well like Eloise does. They have made changes, and even if we end up in the same place as the books it doesn't mean we are all going to agree. Bridgerton is more diverse than other historical pieces set in Regency England. And also the diversity in this show so far has been just black women and men (important characters), no other ethnicities. I should say that I like the queen very much but once again she is undesirable. Regé-Jean Page as Simon Basset and Phoebe Dynevor as Daphne Bridgerton in "Bridgerton" on Netflix. We're not asking for these characters to be pure and perfect, we're asking them not to continue damaging stereotypes and using poc characters as tools. They then use her to be a reflection for Daphne to learn from. Be grateful! Just because someone is rich or have status doesn’t mean they aren’t still a stereotype or servant to the plot. They are minor characters. Her character loses desirability, innocence, purity and everything else that this show deems admirable. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Premiered Dec 25, 2020. I’m not backing OP bc I share their opinion, per se. When you boil it down, Marina is still basically the black single mom who got knocked up and left (before you realize he’s dead). She’s just removed. But the reality is the series is not an exact replica of the books. Although the role for Marina was open casting and they went with the best actress. I think that we can still like the show and the characters while recognizing that some stereotypes and social expectations are still being reinforced. So you have the Queen, Lady Danbury, Marina, Genevieve Delacroix (and Will's wife) - all black women/characters, different backgrounds, ages, occupations, wealth etc. The first season consists of eight episodes with a runtime of 57-72 minutes each. They are tokenist because although their statuses are different, they are still “strong black women who don’t need no man”. No. Yeah it's sad when people are killed because of their race, denied jobs because of their race, are not given prompt medical treatment because of their race, are assumed to be less educated, or criminals because of their race. Married to King George III (who is portrayed by James Fleet on the series), Charlotte of Mecklenburg-Strelitz was Queen of the United Kingdom from 1761 to 1818. In Bridgerton, you have 4 of the major households black (Simon's, Queen, Danbury, Will's). Premiered Dec 25, 2020. This show would be the perfect medium for expansion. The main characters are Daphne and Simon. I’m reading this whole whole thread, and YOU are about the only person that gets it. I can respect your opinion but I do believe there’s a space between having a big storyline and just being monochromatic side character. Would they be more sexy? You have Marina, who is desirable, and not just strong but also shows heartbreak - first when she thinks that George doesn't want anything to do with her, then when she finds out that he died, she shows she wants love and the best for her child when she goes after Colin, moments of weakness when she tries to end her pregnancy, and later explains to Colin why she tried to trick him - she's not just a strong black woman, she's quite complex. Once that fails and George is revealed to be dead, she’s ultimately left nowhere as a character. Bridgerton Season 2 Release Date ‘Bridgerton’ season 1 premiered in its entirety on December 25, 2020, on Netflix. I’m not wishing they were more powerful, I’m wishing they were more human. Just the fact that you said the whole show would change if Daphne was Black proves that “color” is always part of the conversation even when it’s not. I think Regé is a very beautiful man and did a great portrayal of Simon, but I also recognize that part of his success in this role is because he has a lighter complexion. Yes. This doesn't seem to be about diversity, but the concern that the call for diversity is causing people to discuss and advocate for changes in canon. It’s about what you do with them as characters beyond just being black. They continue to play the same roles over and over with no room for growth. I can understand your point about the demographic implications of having an all black cast but movies/productions like Black Panther and Hamilton prove that it can be done well and still be successful. I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Regé-Jean Page is departing the Netflix global sensation “Bridgerton” ahead of Season 2, which is going into production this spring. As a businessperson I’m sure you’ve come across papers/critical reviews of works before and this is what that is. But the reality is the series is not an exact replica of the books. There is a post about Marina maybe being a stereotype - black teen pregnancy, which maybe is true, but doesn't have to be the case in other countries. Much like the minstrel characters of black women you see in the late 19th / early 20th centuries. And worst of all, at the end of the series she just gets shipped away as if she never existed. I know they are not the main characters but I think you could have cut one of Daphne’s and the Dukes MANY sex scenes to develop some of these characters even a little. I am honestly confused as to why people don't look at the characters as they are beyond the color/race or ethnicity they have. I am alienating the story from the underlying context of the characters in an attempt to explore the racial implications of progressive pieces such as this. In the end, how much of an impact do these discussions have on what the writers will write anyway? The closest that comes to being seen as “desirable” and “relevant” to the story is Marina who eventually falls into the “single woman who don’t need no man” trope. Premiered Dec 25, 2020. Like why don’t we see her being occasionally soft like Violet Bridgerton? We can love the show for what it does good and critique it for what it does bad. does not mean the show doesn't merit discussion around diversity and how it can be improved, but most of the points in OPs post don't really seem rational. I only see the struggles of a woman in a time period where toxic masculinity and patriarchy were dominant and I am pretty sure that was the main story the show was telling. Discussion of the show Bridgerton on Netflix. For all her “strength” who really wants to be Marina at the end of the day? Bridgerton is an American streaming television period drama series created by Chris Van Dusen and produced by Shonda Rhimes.It is based on Julia Quinn's novels set in the competitive world of Regency era London's ton during the season, when debutantes are presented at court.Bridgerton is Shonda Rhimes's first scripted Netflix series. Chris said it wasn't color blind casting but color conscious casting. A stereotype in one country or culture doesn't mean that other countries have the same stereotype. Each book in this eight book historical romance series features a member of the Bridgerton family. Her resolution was also super unsatisfying because of how grim and loveless it was... and this is a romance series! It can't possibly be held accountable or a magic touch for the past wrongdoings of American culture and history. The queen gets glimpses of character development throughout the season but she doesn’t go through much transformation in the end (hopefully we see it in season 2). (Queen and Danbury). I just don’t feel like handing out A’s for effort no matter how much I like the show. Diversity Recruiting – What it is, and What isn’t Press J to jump to the feed. It means being underdeveloped and indistinguishable in overall symbolism and influence of the story. This is my least favorite kind of racial condescension. Discussion of the show Bridgerton on Netflix. I think that the criticism of Marina’s character is really valid. Thank you ! Yes this is a period piece, but a fictional one. It's why Regé as the Duke had such an impact.
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